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Going into Business - 2007/04/07 19:51Hello. I have been reading this forum and lurking trying to find out everyone's thoughts. My kids and i will start a bait business at first and then continue to grow the worms for sale as composters and other uses.
My plan is to sell to the independent garen shops in our area, advertise in free papers, and sale wholesale to bait shops. I anticipate a year before we can start selling large quanties to home garden users.
As for bait, would both the Canadain crawlers and the European crawlers be best? I live in VA
As for the home gardner/composter, would the Europen crawlers work there too or should I go with the workhorse?
Is it hard to break into the bait market? Is there a competative advantage to a small grower versuses large growers? Unrefrigerated verses refrigeration?
So many questions... I know many of you have been helping out, thank you. I hope a few more questions won'thurt.
Also, I see a lot of info on taking care of the worms but not as much as the business side - marketing and promotions.
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WFike
User A Protected Species Earthworm
Posts: 196
Re:Going into Business - 2007/04/08 13:45How much room have you got to raise your worms in? It will take a fairly large amount of beds to do what you want. Have you raised worms before? If not don't count on selling any for about three years. You need a big worm and a small worm. Probably red wigglers and Europeans will fit the bill. Most bait shops will not buy from you if you also sell retail in their area unless they have a supply problem. Most bait wholesalers make their customers buy all of their bait from them or they will not service them. I know several people that did this with old refrigerators. What will you make your beds out of? You can't competively raise Canadain crawlers. you have to "pick" them in Canada and up north. You should look into mealworms as the raise easily. (great bream bait). If you raise big reds you can sell all you can raise. How will you seperate them? You need to build a seperator to sort the worms. Have I mentioned that this is a lot of work, that you will need an inside location with lights on at night to keep the worms from having a mass exodus one night, (it is a site to see before you cry!) You will need enough experience to know how many worms to sell as you can sell yourself out of business real quick! Have you got a cool place to cup up and store the worms? be prepared to spend all of your thursdays cupping up worms! (just a few thoughts) good luck!
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Swimmus
User A Mature Breeder Earthworm
Posts: 76
Re:Going into Business - 2007/04/08 17:44Thanks for the info.
I did raise worms as a kid to sell as bait- actually caught them first though.
for this seasson, my plan is start growing and selling at the same time by buying the worms in 5 to 10 pound lots. As the stock gets low, I plan on buying more. At the same time, we will have the little critters doing the wild thing in their own little bins.
Also, will be sinking the profits (cash flow) into buying more worms to add to the "farm".
I will use my basement to house those little critters as well, it is nice and cool in the summer (summer avg 80-90 with high humidity) and winters that vary with teens at night on occassion.
We live in Charlottesville area of Virginia (actually a little north, but a good reference.)
Once we have a good supply, then I will slowly start to sell the worms to households as a starter kit for composting and the castings (like you said earlier, that may be three years away.
My big advantage, I believe, is the marketing side. Bait sales seem to be pretty static- ie been done the same way for many years. In todays marketplace, it's all about distribution and differentiation and i believe there is an opportunity in differentiating the product from others and distributing it through Guerrilla marketing tactics. (No one in my area does what we will be doing.)
I anticipate needing about 100k worms to start doing any selling for composting, does that sound right?
If it starts to grow beyond my basement, then we have access to another 2500 sq foot facility that is climate controlled in a basement of a former wharehouse. (that is if the market appears to support that many worms)
A few more questiosn I have is- The Casting tea is it feasible to sell to local Southern States, etc. Is the tea worthwhile doing if you could supply the stores in the short time frame? (I live in a heavy Agriculture area and could make and deliver the tea to 25 stores in one day)
Multiple smaller bins versus several larger bins- any advantages or dis advantages?
Any special liscense needed? Any special permits needed?
Ok, I think I can rest a little bit,once again thanks again for any replies.www.wormcrusader.com
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Marshall
User A Protected Species Earthworm
Posts: 138
Re:Going into Business - 2007/04/08 19:23Swimmus wrote: believe there is an opportunity in differentiating the product from others and distributing it through Guerrilla marketing tactics.
Can you explain differentiating to me please??? Also Guerrilla marketing tactics.
Good luck with your enterprise.
MarshallAge and treachery will always overcome youth and skill
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Swimmus
User A Mature Breeder Earthworm
Posts: 76
Re:Going into Business - 2007/04/08 20:06Sure.
A guerilla tactic (in this instance) would be to distribute your product in a way in which your competitor could not compete. As an example (crazy example, but you'll get the point) You could deliver your bait to all the local fishing holes personally and interact with your customers, get to know them one on one, then sell them your baits by building a relationship with them. Your competitor relies on the customer to come to a store and actively seek his product. he can not personally deliver the product to end user and hence can not directly compete with your business. Make sense?
If you sell bait how do you make your bait stand out? You make your bait different- either by packaging it differently, selling the advantage of your worm over your competitor's or servicing your customer better. An example would be selling Euro night crawlers against Canadian crawlers because Euro crawlers do not need to be kept in a cool location- which gives EN an apparent advantage and makes it different.
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Marshall
User A Protected Species Earthworm
Posts: 138
Re:Going into Business - 2007/04/08 20:27Swimmus wrote: Does that clear it up?
Sure does. Thankyou.
MarshallAge and treachery will always overcome youth and skill
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Swimmus
User A Mature Breeder Earthworm
Posts: 76
Re:Going into Business - 2007/04/08 20:49I would really like to hear from you all what you do marketing wise, to attract customers. Specifically, are you doing anything to create a market?www.wormcrusader.com
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WFike
User A Protected Species Earthworm
Posts: 196
Re:Going into Business - 2007/04/08 22:25as to "my plan is start growing and selling at the same time by buying the worms in 5 to 10 pound lots." I am not tring to throw a wet blanket on the works here but you would be better off to produce the worms first and then start the sales program. You actually don't know if you can grow them until you try. Most people kill off their first stock in the learning process. If you can produce big reds and good Euros then you can sell them without any trouble if there is fishing going on in your area. You can sell over the internet without any problem. Telling someone that you can supply them and then depending on someone else to get you the worms will only cause you trouble. Those people that you promised to supply will not be wanting to do business with you at all when someone lets you down and you let them down. How you sell will depend a lot on your location. Best to stay in the wholesale end of it if possible as the retail end of it has long hours starting early in the morning and going late in the afternoon. Lot easier to deliver a few hundred cups of worms to a few places and be through with it for a few days. I have been on both ends and I liked the wholesale end better. All yopu have to do to get business is raise good bait. Go to a bait shop in your area and see what kind of crap they are selling for bait and you will see what I mean.
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WFike
User A Protected Species Earthworm
Posts: 196
Re:Going into Business - 2007/04/08 22:42If you do get it started you need to stay with one bait shop at first and get him supplied before taking on several and disappointing them all when something goes wrong. (it will) You wont get but one chance with them! I never bought from anyone without seeing their operation and deciding if they could do what they said with what they had. Can you pack up worms in cups and keep them alive for over a week? It is not as easy as it sounds. If you can't you will have to give their money back next time you come by!
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Swimmus
User A Mature Breeder Earthworm
Posts: 76
Re:Going into Business - 2007/04/08 23:00Actually, I am planning on growing them and selling them (at a very slow pace, of course) I know there will a learning curve. Primarily, this will a little business to start with my kids (we are a homeschool family, so the learning potential is huge.)
As for buying them, I don't expect to do it too much, just if I need to in the first season. I plan on buying from Bob here on the boards until the little critters have produced enough to be sustainable. I expect to sell, this year, about 15-20 dozen a week or so.
Next Season, if all goes well, then I'll ramp up.
What would be a reasonable number to support 5-8 stores selling 20 dozen a week be?
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vermiman
User A Mature Breeder Earthworm
Posts: 85
Re:Going into Business - 2007/04/09 00:0020 dozen worms = 240 worms 240 worms * 4 weeks per month = 960 worms 960 worms * 8 stores = 7680 worms
worms usually double in three months
7680 worms * 3 months = 23040 worms
If you can maintain the proper conditions, 23000 worms would sustain 8 stores at 20 dozen per week.
Post edited by: vermiman, at: 2007/04/09 00:12It's Black Gold!! It'sSquirmy Tea!!
John 3:16 Acts 2:21
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fourmares
User A Protected Species Earthworm
Posts: 124
Re:Going into Business - 2007/04/09 01:31That's best case senerio... I'd plan on having double or triple that number.
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Swimmus
User A Mature Breeder Earthworm
Posts: 76
Re:Going into Business - 2007/04/09 02:29fourmares wrote: That's best case senerio... I'd plan on having double or triple that number.
I stated earlier that I was estimating at 100k. I expect I could be able to manage 100 k within 6 months and invest 1500 or so to get the "herd" to that number.
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vermiman
User A Mature Breeder Earthworm
Posts: 85
Re:Going into Business - 2007/04/09 09:37fourmares wrote: That's best case senerio... I'd plan on having double or triple that number.
On average 2 cocoons per mature worm per week. 2 to 20 worms hatch(average 4). Best case? No, I'd say that that is below average case.
Post edited by: vermiman, at: 2007/04/09 10:05It's Black Gold!! It'sSquirmy Tea!!
John 3:16 Acts 2:21
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WFike
User A Protected Species Earthworm
Posts: 196
Re:Going into Business - 2007/04/09 10:58What store only needs 15 or 20 doz. worms a week? I used to sell 300 to 400 cups of 100 count reds every weekend. A vienna sausage can level full of worms was the measure of a good cup of reds.
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Swimmus
User A Mature Breeder Earthworm
Posts: 76
Re:Going into Business - 2007/04/09 13:59Well it definitley helps if you are in a fish heavy place. Central Virginia is not . Plus, you have to break into the market.www.wormcrusader.com
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WFike
User A Protected Species Earthworm
Posts: 196
Re:Going into Business - 2007/04/09 17:46Whenever anyone came by my store with what I would call good red worms I would buy everything they could bring me. I bought them all out of business as they sold to many worms and wiped out their breedstock! You may need to evaluate your options on who to sell to if there is no fishing in your area. Selling to other growers is easier as you only need to raise the worms to bedrun status.
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Swimmus
User A Mature Breeder Earthworm
Posts: 76
Re:Going into Business - 2007/04/09 18:27That is good to know. The possibilities for this business is much greater than it appears on the surface.www.wormcrusader.com
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tfabry
User A Hatchling Earthworm
Posts: 14
Re:Going into Business - 2007/04/14 11:17What are you planning on selling them for (cost) wholesale and retail? Do you have enough food sources lined up for 100k worms or more?
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Swimmus
User A Mature Breeder Earthworm
Posts: 76
Re:Going into Business - 2007/04/14 15:17What are you planning on selling them for (cost) wholesale and retail? Do you have enough food sources lined up for 100k worms or more?
Thw wife is in catering and we have hundreds of acres of farms to draw upon when needed.
As for pricing, I expect to have to experiment and find the happy medium. The other factor is that I will create my own marketing playfield against the competitors ie exploit a niche.www.wormcrusader.com
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markbrauer
User A Protected Species Earthworm
Posts: 248
Re:Going into Business - 2007/12/25 12:14Hey Swimmus, how's it going? Are you in Earlysville? My grandmother lives out that way, I'm over in Hampton. I know this is an older post, but would like to hear an update. I'm looking at the business aspect also, the only thing holding me back is space for the time being. I'd love to shoot ideas back and forth if you want. I also talk to a guy out of Richmond from here. Since this board doesn't have a way to directly contact, shoot me an e-mail if you'd like to chat, markbrauer@gmail.com.-:Mark:- MEInc.us Hampton, VA
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