markbrauer
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Worms and Maggots (not in the same bin) - 2007/11/29 14:52
I've been vermicomposting for a little bit now, just a backyard project. I don't have the land or funds at the moment and I have a full time job (US Air Force) that keeps me pretty busy. But I have been thinking of bigger scale ideas, but without the chance to try them. My current one is a mass solid waste saving idea, a bit beyond the scope of just organic waste. I was wondering if anyone had any insight on this...
We all know how beneficial worms are, but they're limited to mostly organic waste, staying away from the meat and milk product and biproducts. But maggots (house and soldier flies) on the other hand clean this up quite nice. I've been researching online, mostly troubleshooting worm bins that have maggots, and the general census says that the the maggots biproduct is really good for the worms to eat. Its already broken down and can further benefit from the worm process. What if you get your food sources in, the ones that are mixed, from say a cafeteria or even a fast food restaurant. Take the entire thing and feed it to maggots. Harvest the maggot poo, mix it with pure sources like manure, grass/leaf cuttings, shredded paper etc and then feed it to the worms.
The first draw back would be the adult stage of the maggots, the pesty fly. But what if it was created like most fly traps, they get in, but can't get out. Maybe a tall bin with an electric zapper top. When the maggots turn into the flying pest, zap. So you have beneficial maggots, no pesty flies.
Any insight on this would be great. Draw backs you can think of, anybody who's actually tested this with negative or positive results. Thanks much!
-:Mark:-
MEInc.us
Hampton, VA
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redhen
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Re:Worms and Maggots (not in the same bin) - 2007/11/29 16:12
We all know how beneficial worms are, but they're limited to mostly organic waste, staying away from the meat and milk product and biproducts.
Worms would love meat and dairy, most do not put those things in an indoor worm bin mostly due to smell and attracting varmints.
What if you get your food sources in, the ones that are mixed, from say a cafeteria or even a fast food restaurant. Take the entire thing and feed it to maggots. Harvest the maggot poo, mix it with pure sources like manure, grass/leaf cuttings, shredded paper etc and then feed it to the worms.
Take a look at this site:
http://www.esrint.com/Bio.html
I have one of these units that I have been field testing for them:http://www.esrint.com/bioconvers.html
I have mine, with the bottom drilled out, set on top of a worm bin. There is no need to harvest the BSF manure, which is very liquid-y. It just drains down into the worm bin.
The first draw back would be the adult stage of the maggots, the pesty fly. But what if it was created like most fly traps, they get in, but can't get out. Maybe a tall bin with an electric zapper top. When the maggots turn into the flying pest, zap. So you have beneficial maggots, no pesty flies.
BSF are not pests and it's presence will in fact reduce housefly population.
If you kill off the adults there will be no larvae as the eggs cannot be laid.
Susan Quinby-Honer
redhen@nc.rr.com
Starve the Landfill...Feed the Earth. |
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markbrauer
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Re:Worms and Maggots (not in the same bin) - 2007/11/29 22:48
I appreciate the quick reply. Now I have to extend my research to the BSF! The unit is pretty darn cool. Do you have any idea how much they tend to sell the plastic ones for?
You said the BSF's aren't pests. How would one get BSF's in, but not house flies? Thats why I figured the "zapping" would be good. (and truth be told, zapping is the only thing that came to mind) It wouldn't matter what gets in, it's not getting out. I would hate to make a site that reduced the cities wast by 50%, but increased the fly epidemic by 200%. And I figured that with all the flies that most places had, I'd get plenty of eggs and maggots before they died.
I noticed you're out of NC. Would you mind if e-mailed you. I'm in VA and I would love to e-mail you some questions. I'll wait for a reply before I do, thanks much!
One more thing... Would it be just as easy as setting the bin out (whether it's the one you linked or my own) to get the flies. Build it they will come? Or do you have to make some effort to keep the bin stacked with flies/maggots? Thanks!
Post edited by: markbrauer, at: 2007/11/29 23:01
-:Mark:-
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redhen
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Re:Worms and Maggots (not in the same bin) - 2007/11/30 09:34
You are welcome to email me anytime.
redhen at nc.rr.com
Susan Quinby-Honer
redhen@nc.rr.com
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Krow
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Re:Worms and Maggots (not in the same bin) - 2007/11/30 20:16
Susan, ESR has been saying the unit will become "available soon" for quite some time, do you have any idea when?
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markbrauer
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Re:Worms and Maggots (not in the same bin) - 2007/11/30 21:52
I just got an e-mail from them today...
The BioPod will be available at the beginning of 2008. Please visit our website thebiopod.com for more information, specifications, features, and benefits of the BioPod. I also wanted to inform you that the unit is only currently available in faux granite stone not green.
Feel free to let me know if you have any further questions.
Thank you,
Sara Myszewski, Office Manager
ESR International
214-306-8741
Hope that helps.
-:Mark:-
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markbrauer
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Re:Worms and Maggots (not in the same bin) - 2007/12/04 12:13
Here's the latest e-mail I got...
The price is $159.00 per unit.
Once you have purchased and assembled the BioPod you simply place it outside in full shade. All you need to do to begin you BioPod is add a little bit of food scraps and top it off with some moist shredded paper as a blanket on top of the scraps. The BSF should show up naturally. Once the BioPod is available for purchase you will have the option to buy a starter colony which will make for a faster start-up or you may need to purchase a starter colony if the BSF do not seem to be showing up naturally. Once you have an established BioPod you should not have to actively get BSF to make homes for they are self-furtile.
I hope this answers your question. Please do not hesitate to ask any other questions you may have.
Thank you
Sara Myszewski
-:Mark:-
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WistarWorms
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Re:Worms and Maggots (not in the same bin) - 2007/12/11 08:39
markbrauer wrote:
You said the BSF's aren't pests. How would one get BSF's in, but not house flies?
One more thing... Would it be just as easy as setting the bin out (whether it's the one you linked or my own) to get the flies. Build it they will come? Or do you have to make some effort to keep the bin stacked with flies/maggots?
Hey Mark. I'm in VA also, Richmond to be exact. Believe me, if you build it, the BSF will come. They have a very health appetite and make quick work of reducing large chunks of food into somethig the worms can easily chop down.
We Are WORM - Resistance Is Futile!
Buddy
Richmond, VA |
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wellsworms
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Re:Worms and Maggots (not in the same bin) - 2007/12/11 09:53
Solider flies sound interesting. But why are the ramps necessary?
You only need two tools in life - WD-40 and Duct Tape. If it
doesn't move and should, use the WD-40. If it shouldn’t move and does,
use the duct tape.
WELLS,vermont
jerry walker 2008 |
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WistarWorms
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Re:Worms and Maggots (not in the same bin) - 2007/12/11 15:09
wellsworms wrote:
But why are the ramps necessary?
They move to higher ground when they are ready to pupate. At this stage, they leave the feeding area after having regurgitated their digestive tracts (they don't eat as adults), and then find a quiet place to puate into adult flies. This behavior makes them very easy to harvest as an animal food source. You simply place a bucket at the end of the ramp to collect them.
We Are WORM - Resistance Is Futile!
Buddy
Richmond, VA |
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markbrauer
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Re:Worms and Maggots (not in the same bin) - 2007/12/12 00:33
I'm about to do some backyard research with 5 gallon buckets. I'll setup now, but it won't get going until Spring when the BSF's get coming. Can't find ANY online, every where's out of them.
One bin is going to be dug mostly in the ground. Holes in the bottom and around the side of the bottom. Holes will be drilled around the side under the lip, for fly entrance and to keep rain from flooding. Going to put a spacer grit guard thing at the bottom to keep the holes from getting clogged. I also have an attachment spin on/off top for easy access (found them online!). This is going to be my doggy poop can. Fill it up, maggots tear it up and the liquidy remains get recycled back into the ground through the holes on the bottom. They'll be on sale late summer, early fall, haha!
Second will be to put over my worm bin. Same basic setup, but it will drain straight to the worm bin. Plan on putting the normal organic waste, but with the addition of meat and dairy products. Lawn scraps will probably go straight to the worms (leaves, grass, etc.).
-:Mark:-
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markbrauer
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Re:Worms and Maggots (not in the same bin) - 2007/12/12 14:09
Here's a link to my blog. It's my doggy poo project. Not much, but thought I'd share. I just put the blog together and need to rush to work, so I'll check it later for misprints and spelling!
http://meinc.us/joomla/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=27&Itemid=32
-:Mark:-
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wellsworms
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Re:Worms and Maggots (not in the same bin) - 2007/12/13 09:55
where can i get BSF in the vermont area of the north east?
You only need two tools in life - WD-40 and Duct Tape. If it
doesn't move and should, use the WD-40. If it shouldn’t move and does,
use the duct tape.
WELLS,vermont
jerry walker 2008 |
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markbrauer
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Re:Worms and Maggots (not in the same bin) - 2007/12/13 10:11
Wait til late spring and they should be around. I think they're everywhere in the US. I've been looking around online to buy some now and get started, but everywhere seems to be out. I think the popular online term is Soldier Grubs. If not, and when I get a Bio Pod, I'll send ya some!
-:Mark:-
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wellsworms
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Re:Worms and Maggots (not in the same bin) - 2007/12/14 08:12
 I’m very interested in this soldier fly thing but this is suppose to be an earthworm forum. Does anyone know where there is an established forum to learn and share info about soldier flies?
You only need two tools in life - WD-40 and Duct Tape. If it
doesn't move and should, use the WD-40. If it shouldn’t move and does,
use the duct tape.
WELLS,vermont
jerry walker 2008 |
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markbrauer
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Re:Worms and Maggots (not in the same bin) - 2007/12/14 11:12
I haven't seen any as of yet. But the start of this thread was to use the two in conjunction. And even though they're not worms I'm sure most would agree that its for the common goal and greater good.
Maybe a better search for forum would be a generic composting site, where any form of organic waste recycling is game. I'll post if I find any!
-:Mark:-
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wellsworms
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Re:Worms and Maggots (not in the same bin) - 2007/12/14 14:15
thanks i have also been looking nl so far
You only need two tools in life - WD-40 and Duct Tape. If it
doesn't move and should, use the WD-40. If it shouldn’t move and does,
use the duct tape.
WELLS,vermont
jerry walker 2008 |
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markbrauer
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Re:Worms and Maggots (not in the same bin) - 2007/12/14 14:18
So you're the dot way up there on my site. Cluster Map is so cool! It just updated today and I had a lot more dots. Pretty neat!
-:Mark:-
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wellsworms
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Re:Worms and Maggots (not in the same bin) - 2007/12/14 14:27
 thanks maybe they will come i have piles of leaves and horse manure mixed around the yard
Post edited by: wellsworms, at: 2007/12/14 14:28
You only need two tools in life - WD-40 and Duct Tape. If it
doesn't move and should, use the WD-40. If it shouldn’t move and does,
use the duct tape.
WELLS,vermont
jerry walker 2008 |
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markbrauer
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Re:Worms and Maggots (not in the same bin) - 2007/12/15 02:18
So here's what I'm going to try with the BSF's and Red Worms. May get Night Crawlers too, we'll see how much they cost online.
My Blog
It's not much, just the annotated workings, and I'll post what I end up with in Fall of 2008, maybe what's going on between now and then. Maybe it will give others ideas and I like to get visitors to my site!
If anybody's doing anything like this let me know! I already talked to RedHen.
-:Mark:-
MEInc.us
Hampton, VA
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wellsworms
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Re:Worms and Maggots (not in the same bin) - 2007/12/17 11:45
after searching i found this statement
"The BioPod ® is the future of food scrap recycling  and will be available in Jan 2008. The MSRP is US$159.00"
hope i can find the money somewhere
You only need two tools in life - WD-40 and Duct Tape. If it
doesn't move and should, use the WD-40. If it shouldn’t move and does,
use the duct tape.
WELLS,vermont
jerry walker 2008 |
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markbrauer
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Re:Worms and Maggots (not in the same bin) - 2007/12/18 22:37
WistarWorms wrote:
markbrauer wrote:
You said the BSF's aren't pests. How would one get BSF's in, but not house flies?
One more thing... Would it be just as easy as setting the bin out (whether it's the one you linked or my own) to get the flies. Build it they will come? Or do you have to make some effort to keep the bin stacked with flies/maggots?
Hey Mark. I'm in VA also, Richmond to be exact. Believe me, if you build it, the BSF will come. They have a very health appetite and make quick work of reducing large chunks of food into somethig the worms can easily chop down.
I just realized that they don't have Private Message. Or the ability to look at people's profiles. That really sucks, considering I use the same Content Manager (Joomla), bummer. Anyway...
Wisterworm. Shoot me an e-mail, since you're in the area. I would like to hear what type of setup you have and how long you've been doing it. markbrauer@gmail.com. Promise I won't stock you! 
-:Mark:-
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CharlieLittle
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Re:Worms and Maggots (not in the same bin) - 2008/04/25 07:04
There is a Bio Pod and BSFL forum at http://thebiopod.com/forum/index.php
It's fairly new as is the whole topic of BSF so we are learning a lot as we go with this critter. I've got a homemade bin set up and waiting on my commercial Bio Pod or Prota Pod, haven't decided which one to get. Am also considering becoming a distributor for the company but have to satisfy myself it is a good product first.
BSFLcomposting.com |
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markbrauer
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Re:Worms and Maggots (not in the same bin) - 2008/04/25 15:37
If you do a search you'll see this topic has matured, but not in this thread. We've been talking about the Bio Pod and getting updates here and there.
My only gripe is that its almost May and still no product. So much for the beginning of the year. One more would be that forum. The 2 or 3 times I posted I didn't response back for like weeks or so.
I have a few home made bins also, but haven't got any action. I'm thinking about dumping my scraps and starting over, now that the BSF's are about in season. I started my bins when I got the idea over the winter. So the stuff I put in there is pretty icky. I saw a few flying around the other day, at least what I thought were BSF. They were small, looked like wasps, but were not slow flying like I've been described.
Curious, what did you make your bins out of? Click on the link to my site, and look under Mark's Blogs and you can read the setup I did with 5 gallon buckets. Let me know how your homemade setup works out!
-:Mark:-
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CharlieLittle
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Re:Worms and Maggots (not in the same bin) - 2008/04/25 17:06
Ah...sorry for the lack of searching then! Yes the Bio Pod forum is a bit slow but I suspect it is just being a new thing and will pick up once the units are available.
I've been trading emails with a fella there at the company about becoming a distributor. I must satisfy myself first of it's quality and the company relations with other distributors before I go jump in to something. I do believe it has great potential.
Your bucket project seems like it should work. My first prototype was a trash can with ramp attached to the outside. Like you I have not any BSF come to call yet and a fella in Georgia is supposed to send me some BSFL to get it started. The odor of the larvae is then supposed to attract more and so on as you already know.
My new design is unfortunately all secret like for the moment. I can say if I do not decide to go with the Bio Pod dealership I will offer inexpensive plans for building my design if it works like I vision it. No power tools needed for construction, under $50 to make with more space than a residential Bio Pod and insulated against cold and heat. It's not really my desire to go and compete with ESR and I hope their units are all that they claim. If for no other reason, I like what they are doing, why they are doing it and the units are just plain cool!
Edited to add...I should add that my experiments so far are working well with Blue Bottle Fly Larvae but they are not what we want eh! I can say a regular fly maggot has a hard time climbing the ramp if it is dry. Any condensation on the sides will allow them to climb straight up a plastic wall. Therefore I omit the lids and keep my bins under a pole barn roof with open ends.
Post edited by: CharlieLittle, at: 2008/04/25 17:11
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